the real “problem with political correctness” is not that it’s considered offensive to use slurs, but that there are now many “progressive” environments where saying the right things is more important than doing the right thing. it’s why it’s so easy for abusers to gain traction in leftist circles (they learn the right words quickly and employ them to frame their own behavior as progressive); it’s why so much potential activist energy gets poured into fighting about language; it’s why moderate liberals didn’t believe fer/guson had a problem until the police emails with actual racist language were leaked. (you can do racist things, you just can’t SAY racist things.) i don’t have a neat conclusion here but a related point is that i’m so much happier since i started focusing on like, being a good kind caring person instead of trying to remove the word “crazy” from the vocabulary of everyone in my family
Just saying this is truly one of the best “discourse” posts on this site like……this hits the nail directly on the head re: what is going on with language right now and everyone pushing back in the notes only serves to further prove the point it’s making
some of the reasons homestuck meets the requirements of a traditional epic!
homestuck is a finely crafted piece of literature that deserves serious discussion and recognition, and it bothers me when people won’t acknowledge that.
Homestuck is the most important piece of literature of the 21st century so far.
I’ve compared Homestuck to Lost in the past, and I’ve oft seen Lost analyzed as a modern twist on the traditional epic. This just makes the comparison even more poignant!
Homestuck is such an incredible piece of literature. I wholeheartedly agree that it’s the most important piece in the 21st century so far. Absolutely.
I want to point out that the plot doesn’t just span civilizations, it spans both genre (space opera, urban fantasy, apocalyptic romp, let’s play, fable,) and medium (epistolary narrative, comic, webcomic, novel, video, videogame). It employs all the accumulated self-aware, self-critical traditions of the latter 20th century to launch into a uniquely self-aware 21st century narrative: it’s not a story that’s epic, it’s an epic about stories.
The narrator struggles for control over the telling with his own metaphorical selves, he’s his own protagonist, deuderagonist, and antagonist— all with the acknowledgement that they’re only controlling the telling, that the story has always been what it is, that they’ve always been part of it, that they’ve always been inside it— and this is also a story that’s written, in significant chunks, by reader suggestion. Are we outside the story? Yes. Maybe. No. The audience is part of the theater, the bard is part of the crowd.
What is Homestuck? By now, the question’s gone from joke to koan and it’s still a completely legitimate question. But if it isn’t an epic, it’s only because we haven’t invented the actual word for it yet.
The tenth anniversary of the OTW and all the AO3 discussion going around this week inspired me to go look at astolat’s original post about creating an An Archive Of Our Own, and found my comment on it:
“I think this is needed and long past needed.
There are of course huge fanfic archives out there like ff.net, but the bigger and more public the site, the more restrictive it is, the more stuff around the edges gets cut off. I don’t WANT the public face of fanfic to be only the most easily palatable stuff, with the smut and the kink and the controversial subjects marginalized and hidden under the table.
And I particularly don’t want to see us all sitting around feeling frustrated while this fabulous community is commodified out from underneath us.
I’m not fit to be a project manager, but I’m great with details and general organizational work. If someone takes this and runs with it, I’d love to help.“
Eleven years and rather a lot of volunteer-hours later, I stand by every single word.
And then I found my original post on the idea that became the OTW/AO3, which says in part:
“However, as I was reading the comments over there, I noticed a frustrating, but not surprising number of comments along the lines of “well, it’s a good idea, but it’s way too ambitious”
I’m not talking about the really useful and practical comments bringing up pitfalls and difficulties to be aware of from the get go with something this massive and complex, I’m talking about all the comments that go something like this:
Taken separately, these comments don’t seem like much, but every time a new one showed up I couldn’t help but be reminded of
this post by commodorified, and her oh so brilliant and beautiful rant therein:
“WOMEN NEED TO LEARN TO ASK FOR EVERY DAMN THING THEY WANT.
And here are some notes:
Yes, you. Yes, everything. Yes, even that.
All of it. Because it’s true. We’re mostly raised to live on table scraps, to wait and see what’s going when everyone else has been served and then choose from what’s left. And that’s crap, and it’ll get you crap.
Forget the limited menu of things that you automatically assume is all that’s available given your (gender, looks, social class, education, financial position, reputation, family, damage level, etc etc etc), and start reading the whole menu instead.
Then figure out what you want. Then check what you’ve got and figure out how to get it. And then go after it baldheaded till either you make it happen or you decide that its real cost is more than it’s worth to you.”
And THAT is what Astolat’s post is about. It’s about saying “THIS is what we want, let’s make it happen.” It’s about aiming for the ideal, not for some artificially imposed, more “realistic” option.
And I think that’s fabulous. And I think we CAN do this, we CAN make this amazing, complicated idea happen. But in order to do so we’re going to have to be careful about those little voices inside our heads saying “well, it’s a nice idea, but” and “there’s no point in trying for that impossible thing, let’s aim for this ‘more realistic’ goal instead.”
Because, damn it, why shouldn’t we ask for every damn thing we want. And why shouldn’t we go out there and get it?”
I am so pleased to have been proved correct.
(And also, in the category of “women need to ask for every damn thing they want”? I took those words to heart, which is one of many reasons Marna/commodorified and I have been married for going on eight years.)
ETA: I know some of the links are broken, they copied over from my original post and I didn’t have the energy to either delete them or track them down elsewhere.
Asking for it and doing it!!!
So inspiring. And yes – at the time this seemed such a pipedream, but look at it now!
Yup. I remember saying I’d support it regardless, but it would only really be useful to me as a poster if it allowed every kind of content. Heh.
God this brings it back. People saying we couldn’t do it, that we would never be able to do it, etc. And then there was the sort of six months later moment where people were like, but where is it? (!) Dudes, we had to found a nonprofit company first! so we could be legal and raise money and pay taxes and have a bank account and enter contracts – and moreover, the archive was written from scratch: from a single blinking cursor on the screen, custom-designed from the ground up. I remember that I had the job of tracking wireframes in the early days as the real designers figured out how the flow of pages in the archive were going to go. Amazing.
Anyway, I want to say that the group that came together around the OTW /AO3 in those first years had a track record like WHOA: so many of those people had been archivists, web-admins, fannish fest-runners, newsletter compilers, community moderators, listmoms (kiddies, you won’t know what this is) or had other fannish roles that gave them enormous experience in working collaboratively in fandom and keeping something great going year after year. And OTW continues to attract great people–and so also, while I’m blathering, let me say that volunteering for the OTW also provides great, real world experience that you can put on your resume, because AO3 is one of the top sites in the world and TWC has been publishing on time for ten years and Fanlore is cited in books and journalism all the time and Open Doors has relationships with many meatspace university libraries and archives etc. so if you think you have something to bring to the table, please do think about volunteering somewhere. It’s work, believe me, but it’s also pretty g-d awesome.
And THAT is what Astolat’s post is about. It’s about saying “THIS is what we want, let’s make it happen.” It’s about aiming for the ideal, not for some artificially imposed, more “realistic” option.
I want to pull this out for a second because I have in fact generally spent much of my life aiming for big unrealistic goals, very few of which I’ve actually achieved, and many of which I didn’t actually want by the time I got close to them.
The thing about aiming for “unrealistic” goals is that the work you do to achieve those goals doesn’t disappear even if you don’t achieve the goal. We still haven’t accomplished everything on our giant AO3 wishlist. There remains plenty of work to be done (and the OTW and the amazing current team working on the AO3 can always use more help, as Cesperanza says!)
But because we collectively threw ourselves at this project, there is an archive, and it’s not just good, it’s better than anything else out there. ❤
(Me: sees your aspects as facets of reality theory and raises
this: Aspects as elements of the story, Light as thematic importance
(see aranea being aranea, vriska stealing importance and luck) Time as
well pacing but also the timeline of a story. Ect ect
YES!
YesYes!! YesYesYes ^u^ ^u^ ^u^
This is another Wonderful Frame for analyzing Homestuck, or thinking about the Aspects ^u^ The one thing I’d say is that while some –like Light, Time, Space, and Heart– are pretty directly and clearly related to literary concepts by the text, others are a bit more difficult to figure out; either because their representative characters get less “screen time”, or because the Literary Concepts the Aspect embodies are more esoteric and vague.
Like: I’ve always had a hard time figuring out what Life could represent in a Literary sense. Fef’s story is surrounded by all sorts of Fairy Tale tropes that she’s laser-focused on either escaping(her role as Princess) or subverting(bringing Sollux, her “Hero”, to life with a kiss, rather than the other way around), and Meenah was also focused on escaping and subverting the life planned for her, so THAT could possibly be Life’s Literary side: either subverting narrative, or the way characters can take on “a life of their own” when the author realizes they’d do C instead of the A they had planned for them, and how that can lead the plot in a whole different direction.
Blood’s another stumper for me in this regard …Though… taking a minute to think about it maybe it’s self-criticism? Like: Karkat is obvsl VERY self critical(in a way Kankri very much is not) but both of them are super-critical of the story-itself and the world Hussie, as author, has set it in. So you could think of Blood as being the Critical or Editorial Impulse? MAYBE??
And Breath’s a good example of an esoteric one. While John’s the protagonist, people are constantly telling him what to do in the narrative, and outside of it through the prompt(at least early in HS), so he’s rarely ever deciding anything for himself. His actions drive the story, but his actions aren’t “his”, so what exactly would that make Breath? Plot? Protagonists&Characters?? Is it something simpler and more obvs like Adventure Game Narratives??? Does it include all of these, or is it one thing that covers all of them?x4 Considering Rufioh with John, something you might call “The Irony of Protagonists” seem rather central to whatever Breath is: on the one hand they’re the “hero” of the story and their actions drive the plot; but on the other that also makes them the most controlled, puppeted, plot-significant, and thus least realistic&”free”, of all the characters in the story.
Rufioh(through many years of bad memory, obvsl, so maybe I’m misrepping this) was the center of the primary romantic drama in his Session(which in turn drove the Session), and many of his fellow Players either pursued him, or openly professed their attraction to him. In this respect, they saw him as sort of like the Protagonist of a Dating Sim. Seeing him as attractive they saw him as confident and a player; they cast a particular narrative and identity onto him based on their perspective of him. But that’s not how Rufioh experienced any of those events, or indeed his life. He felt powerless and disrespected throughout; pulled one way then another by both Horuss and Damara, constantly uncomfortable with the desires others expressed for him(and the disinterest of everyone in what he wanted), trapped by his social situation into conditions and roles he never really wanted, and always betraying himself and his own feelings through his lack of confidence, and the inability to take a stand it created. Even thousands and thousands of years later his friends are STILL giving him agency for events he felt were forced on him against his will, and casually hitting on him despite his clear discomfort with it seen in Meenah’s walkaround. So, while he is defined as the “Protagonist” of his story according to those “reading” and telling it, he felt like all he ever did was just what other people told him to do, and chafes against the identity others have forced on him, which he has no control over. In this respect, he experienced all of that as a “Target” of a Dating-Sim; to be dated and wooed, but with no agency of his own.
While much more extreme(and negative), that experience shares some notable qualities with John’s. It suggests that Breath might be “The Illusion of Freedom” literary characters have, and Rufioh’s story suggests audience collaboration is a pivotal aspect of this illusion.
I’m not even much of a fan of genderbends but goddamn am I even less of a fan of getting ordered around about what I should enjoy and how I should enjoy it and being lectured about how ‘problematic’ it is, when the real problem is that they’ve cast the thing in question in black and white and refuse to admit that there’s anything but their narrow framing.
Changing a character to the ‘opposite’ cis gender is a very different thing than making them trans or nonbinary. Insisting that people only change characters to trans is also really damn invalidating, because it implies that being trans is interchangable with being cis. Whoopsie doodle!
I think the real issue here is that a lot of people want to see more trans headcanons, but for some reason think that using sj words while being bossy and rude is the way to go about it. Dress it up in progressive language all you like; at the end of the day you’re still being bossy and rude to get what you want, regardless of anyone else’s valid feelings.
i get really irritated at kids who scream that genderbends are transphobic because they’re completely missing the context and history. they have no idea. it’s like to them, Cis People made up genderbends specifically to thumb their noses at trans people.
rule 63 was originally a guy thing, sexual objectification thing. it states ‘for every male character, there’s a female version of that character’, and not because the dudes who were into it cared about having more realistically rendered female heroes in their media. it was made popular on 4chan and porn boards and comics+gaming forums because you could reduce a manly male character into a sexy tits-and-ass pinup. there were related kinks of sissification, but mostly it was about getting to jerk it to a sexy female version of a previously unappealing, macho male character.
then women got hold of the rule and started going, okay. let’s look at the female version of this male character. let’s talk about being a woman in a man’s world. let’s talk about rorschach’s misogyny, tony stark’s womanizing, batman’s grimness, the fact there’s one girl ninja to every four or five guy ninjas, let’s talk about that in the hypothetical context of these male heroes being women instead. if there’s a girl version for every male character, what does that mean? what’s her story?
and it became this really amazing lens for female fans to interrogate stories through, to examine the effects of sexism and misogyny and masculinity, to introduce another woman into a story with very few, to identify with fully-rendered heroes of the fan’s own gender. and to interrogate the very nature of gender, which led into the development of genderbends where the character’s gender identity didn’t necessarily match their assigned sex, and from there an increasing interest in, and familiarity with, trans characters, trans people, and trans issues.
so like. people now reducing the issue to ‘cis people are gross and hate trans people’ is pretty ridiculous. it ignores basically twenty years of women questioning, confronting and then dismantling the de-facto heteronormative, exploitative male gaze in order to create the radically progressive fandom atmosphere as we know it today on tumblr.
I’d been trying to put into words my issue with the idea that genderbent versions of characters are somehow automatically, innately transphobic, and I think you pretty well nailed it.
Originally, it was called ‘genderswap’ or ‘genderswitch’, which was rightfully criticized for reinforcing a binary view of gender. Hence why it is now ‘genderbend‘. Things can bend in many directions.
Yeah basically.
Rule 63s can be transphobic and gender essentialist, no question, just as m/m slash can be misogynistic, but it’s not inherent to the genre.
The way I see it, rule 63 and trans/nb headcanons are two subsets of what I call “gender AUs”, and they’re not mutually exclusive. Girl!Sherlock Holmes is an example of one, trans!Holmes is the other, and trans woman Holmes is both. All those would be worthwhile explorations.
Yes! And all sorts have their place because all of them are exploring the experience of an under-represented group (or two) in a different way.
Thank you for writing this 🙂 I never want to tell people that their feelings are invalid, but sometimes I think those feelings come from gut negative reactions that deserve to be re-examined. Like in this case, trans people have every right to be wary of something that could – and admittedly, sometimes does – re-enforce difficult gender stereotypes, and they also have every right to say genderbent art/fic isn’t to their taste or ask people to tag it.
But there’s nothing inherently transphobic about art that explores gender – quite the opposite, I think – and that’s what genderbends are about. It can be hugelybeneficial to imagine male characters as female in order to explore roles that aren’t traditionally given to women (I would really love to see a genderbent take on, say, Stacker Pentecost for that exact reason).
i was playing pokemon blue on stream earlier at 350% speed and i got to thinking
what if the reason nobody in the pokemon world has any good teams is because its considered a dick move to have a proper team comp
like culturally everyone is like “haha pick the pokemon you want! if you’re happy with three geodudes, thats you and your life!” and then you’re supposed to just have a friendly battle with any other pokemon trainers and whatever pokemon they just happen to have
like the average trainer is probably just walking around with a growlithe because that’s their pet, or a hiker has three geodudes because the geodudes help him with hiking. and if this pet owner and geodude hiker meet, you’re supposed to have a friendly battle but nothing too serious
now imagine the 10 year old kid that has six pokeballs on their belt comes up. you’re like “haha, we’ll have a friendly battle!” and you throw out your geodude
and they throw out a fucking gyarados, and it one-shots your geodude
and then you throw out your pidgey you have because the pidgey helps you navigate mountains because you’re a hiker
and then electricity crackles around the gyarados and a thunderbolt flies off of this giant dragon and evaporates your pidgey
so you’re down to your last pokemon. you tell them you’re gonna send out your bulbasaur. the ten year old is like “oh okay in that case i’m gonna pull out my vulpix.” like not only is this kid walking around with an amped-up super dragon, but theyve also got multiple pokemon specifically for making type advantage counter-picks?
this kid’s a fucking asshole! really, kid? what are you trying to prove here? this is a friendly match between strangers for fun! why are you composing real-ass competitive teams? what a fucker!
Maybe since Peridots aren’t made for combat they’re designed to poof faster if they’re being attacked by another gem in the hopes that their gems will be left alone. They don’t poof very easily when taking damage from non-gem sources because its assumed support will be there in a minute or two to help them out during construction projects/kindergarden related tasks.
Makes sense! They’re engineers so they’re expected to take a few hard knocks. Susceptibility to gem weaponry might be intended to prevent rebellion of the technical caste.
Actually… have we seen a gem ever be poofed by something that wasn’t by the direct action of another gem?
Oh woah
amethyst falls off a cliff and only scratches her gem, but gets poofed by jasper’s attack, i think it was a kick or a headbutt? actually, if you think about gems who have taken the most direct damage from other gems, pearl wins so far. she got kicked around like a sportsball by sugillite, one of the very strongest gem fusions, and didn’t poof.
perhaps if technician gems like peridot are meant to buckle quickly in combat situations, pearls are meant to hold up under whatever physical abuse their much, much larger superiors dish out. i don’t think a diamond or high-ranking quartz would be pleased with a toy that snaps the first time they smack it, and doesn’t regenerate for weeks.
imagine younger pearl realizing that how much abuse she was built to take could actually be a huge asset in battle, and let her face down gems ten times her size. imagine frustrated quartzes realizing this too.
The Final Pam really is an absolutely inspired creation
The implementaion of Fallout 4′s story, the setting, and the game mechanics are exactly what makes Final Pam the end conclusion of indifferent, unimpressed gameplay, deliberately avoiding immersion at all costs. The use of an engine we all already know the dev codes for, enabling them to enact mass murder RIGHT from the goddamn start in the tutorial… obviously leading to the first characterisation of Pam as all-powerful, bending the will of reality – “I do this.”
The way the game constantly tries to act dramatic in somewhat absurd ways. Watching a nuke go off, escaping seconds before the impact of the blast wave? Of course it’s okay, this is The Final Pam, pock-marked immortal. All Monster Factories are tests – the McElroys pitting their ability to distort a player character’s appearance against the game’s insistence that they conform to its rules. And Fallout 4 is the pinnacle of that idea, since the game itself relies on forcing you to conform to it incessantly. You have to care about the story they feed you. You have to comply with the regular rules of an RPG, stats and numbers, working hard for your weapons and gear, earning them.
The McElroys delight in not just distressing the hell out of a character creator, but extending that to kick the game’s formality apart. Final Pam does not need to search for her son. They spawn in a thousand ghost boys and coffee tins. The Final Pam does not salvage or explore for armour. She spawns in a test cell and takes what she wants. The Final Pam doesn’t give a shit about preserving the delicate integrity of the intro sequence, and they kill everyone just to see what would happen, discovering they can cause a Vertibird to crash. The Final Pam invalidates the entire supposedly frantic rush for the safety of the underground vault in the face of imminent nuclear explosion. Brb, Final Pam forgot keys.
Some of those moments of characterisation are accidental and some are just experience of knowing how to cheat combined with great improv instincts. Final Pam would not have emerged from a Monster Factory in an indie game or a lesser known, more modest game. It’s the legacy behind Bethesda, and the way Fallout 4 obviously expects you to behave and react that prompts Final Pam to behave so erratically, the way Fallout 4 is supposed to be a polished multimillion juggernaut that makes it so amusing to see Final Pam decimate the bounds of virtual reality, and the dogmatic insistence of Bethesda that the player watch their story unfold, engage only in the narrative they have set out for you, that makes it so enjoyable for Final Pam to completely ignore it, right from the very first notion that she is married to Trash Hulk, she rejects and takes instead a metal husband. She doesn’t look for her son, and instead finds a field of ghost boys.
Final Pam could only have been borne from Fallout 4, because in the power tug-of-war between player and developer that is the basis for Monster Factory, in this game the tools and humour and narrative irrelevance existed to make the McElroy’s creation surpass everything that existed around her.
just moving along like everyone else 